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7/12/2018 2:08:48 AM
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That's actually the problem. This is the problem with Star Wars and all this shit about forcing us to confront our "bigotry". The problem is that we aren't bigots in the first place. I would have LOVED, absolutely loved it if Ana Bray was developed as a fully fledged character in the campaign of Warmind. (Actually, that applies to every character and every campaign.) I do not object to her being a woman, or that she chooses a woman as a lover. That's cool. That's who she is. Awesome. The problem is that I have no fxcking clue who she is otherwise. It's hidden in the lore somewhere that she was a badass gunslinger at one time and that she did all these... these... things... Oh! Right! That's where I draw a fxcking blank because her story, her struggles, her achievements, her choices (good or bad), [i]are not in the fxcking story.[/i] I have no idea who she is as a person, as a guardian. I guess I could ask My Name is Byf, because he's the only one that even gives a shit to actually tell these stories unlike Bungie. But it ain't in the game. Maybe instead of "sending messages" about inclusiveness or diversity or whatever, they could give her a narrative that actually tells the bigger story of Destiny, something this game [i]sorely[/i] needs. It could include romance. With a female. With a male. With a robot... we don't give a fxck. But slapping together a comic that's basically just another forced message we didn't need in the first place? I mean the whole point is to see her as a relatable character with struggles and dreams and hopes and badassery, as an individual. [i]Not to just see her as a pawn[/i], a character stuffed in a categorized box that says "I'm gay and that's all you need to know about me." That's even [b]more[/b] bigoted. Aloy from Horizon Zero Dawn could turn out to be gay at some point, and I would not bat an eye. Do you know why? Because she is an awesome character. I got to see her grow, I got to experience fighting fxcking Thunderjaws with her. I got to see her power through a world too scared of their own fears and discover who she truly is and how that fits into the story of HZD. Didn't care she had a vagina. Didn't care if she was white or black or gay or ginger or what the fxck ever. I cared about her story because I got to bond with her as a human being in that game. I related to her struggles, worried for her, cheered for her, because they told an awesome story and developed her character. And it wasn't a story about "Look how awesome I am for having ovaries" or "better get ready to accept me you bigot gamers." They gave us reasons to want to pick the controller up and play as Aloy every day. What does Ana Bray do? She drones about "I've got to uncover my family's past" even though we don't ever even see that past or her family's secrets. We see basically nothing about her in the game. We read something here or there. But if she died in the tomorrow I couldn't care less. Because she is a stranger. And all I know about her is she had a girlfriend. Wow. That's great Ana. I had a dog that died one time, that was sad too. She's a stranger, a cardboard cutout I don't even know. Never seen her fight. Never seen her make a tough choice. Never seen her fight along side me on the ice caps of Mars. I've seen her type, I've heard her say, "Trust Rasputin" though no one really knows why we should, and I've seen her give me the same shitty cloak 4 times in a row. How bout have her be [i]more[/i] than just her sexuality. Have her be more than just a political talking piece. Have her be a great character we can relate to.
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  • [quote]It's hidden in the lore somewhere[/quote] So is the fact that she's gay... you literally have to go out of your way to read the comic that makes any mention of her love life. It's just as obscure as the rest of her story, inside of the gameplay, so try again.

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  • We went out of our way to read to the comic because they [i]don't include story stuff like this in the game.[/i] If you want to make sense of the story or even get any story, you have to look elsewhere. And when you do, you just find a poorly written romance that reveals nothing about the Brays or the Warminds.

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  • So then, what's your problem?

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  • Oh, we starting over? That it? That instead of showing us a story about Ana and her family and the Warmind and to how all of that relates to the darkness, we just got to see a poorly told romance just to send us the "gay is okay" message, when we didn't need that reminder in the first place.

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  • How can you be so sure that this was all just to send a message that gay is ok? Maybe it was just a poorly written comic. Regardless of Bungie’s “agenda”, simply assuming that this was some kind of way for Bungie to “force” diversity is where the problem begins. Why can’t you just take it at face value and walk away? Why does it have to be a thing at all? Why... because it makes these people uncomfortable so they have to make themselves feel better by posting stuff online about how this is all some political agenda. They’re not complaining that this is bad writing. Try again...

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  • No one that wanted to read the comic cares if she was gay. We all wanted to see cool character defining moments and shit she did, not some forced narrative and even more vague Destiny lore.

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  • Edited by gizzamaluke: 7/12/2018 9:51:39 PM
    Then why isn't the title of the OP something more like, "The Bray Comics Sucked" or "Bungie Sucks at Story Telling"? Seems pretty obvious that this isn't just about a lack of character development and/or disappointment in vague lore.

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  • He’s saying they suck BECAUSE of the forcing of diversity.

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  • And you're saying they suck because the writing is bad... And I'm saying the diversity only feels "FORCED" if you have a problem with it.

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  • No the writing is bad because they try to shove irrelevant crap in it. If you can’t see what the problem is then you’re the problem.

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  • Lmao classic My Name Is Byf

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  • If not for him and Myelin, I'd know fxck all about the actual stories of Destiny lol.

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  • It's funny how you and I both agree she is a poorly developed character. The difference between you and the OP is that he is fixating on this individuals sexuality. I have no qualms about someone saying the character is poorly written and uninspiring. It's an awful plot/story. But the OP is blasting "FORCED" diversity in all caps. Then he adds this in an edit... [quote]Edit2: Don’t dwell on the comic and Ana Bray. The conversation is much larger than that.[/quote] So by his own admission this isn't about the comic or Ana Bray, it's about LGBTQ characters having important roles in art forms. Don't be naive to think otherwise.

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  • Yeah because it is. That still is not him saying "Because I hate gays." The same thing is happening in Star Wars and Mass Effect and Movies and everything. With Gender, Race, Sexual Preference, and all in between. Star Wars currently is blaming white men for their latest movie doing terribly. The directors and producers are pointing at the fans and claiming, "Well they just aren't comfortable with Strong Women taking the lead." No. That's not it. They wrote a shitty storyline and shitty scenes. Fans have loved badass women in movies and games for quite a LONG time now. Princess Leia for example. We liked her not because someone said, "Look! She's a woman! And strong!" We loved her because she was badass, a capable leader, could throw one liners back at Han all day, [i]choked fxckin Jaba out,[/i] and looked great doing all of it. Rey on the other hand? I think she's cool. I [i]want[/i] to connect with her, but they are writing her terribly. She didn't train with a light saber, didn't struggle to grasp the force, she just popped on the scene and did it all. Essentially we are being [i]told[/i] to just accept that she's a badass, but rarely see her fail or learn to overcome. Luke could barely stack rocks with the force, she just heaves them up with zero training. It leads to shitty writing, which is what everyone got with the Last Jedi. A 2 hour long spaceship chase, a meandering plot that accomplished nothing, and a poor take on the lore. We've loved strong characters forever, no matter what style they came in. [i]Most especially[/i] in gaming. We loved raiding tombs and figuring out puzzles with Lara Croft, but all the feminists cared about was that she had disproportionate tits and looked great in shorts. We didn't hammer game after game just because Lara looked good. There's porn for that. Even the newest version of her was ridiculed for making her skinny! Wtf!! We got to see her go through trauma of going from a survivor to a tomb raiding villain slaying machine, we were there to see her shoot a guy in the face and gag because of it. But when these political agendas come into the scene to "educate" us, the focus shifts to "look how Woman she is! Look how she can punch guys! Look how gay she is! See!! Look! Look how Black she is!" We do, not, mind and we do, not, care. Blade was black. We loved him because he was a vampire slaying ninja. And great! Hell yeah, he was black! Awesome. Aloy was a woman. We loved her because she ventured out where her people wouldn't go, and stood up against people thinking she was a freak with no mother. She uncovered not only the huge revelation of her own origin, but the origin of the [i]entire world she lived in.[/i] She did amazing shit along the way. And yet I'm terrified of what this "narrative" you advocate for wound do to these characters and their amazing stories. If they remade blade in today's time, dollars to doughnuts they would shift the focus away from the lore of the underground Vampire threat, and onto social issues concerning police violence and hate crime. The vampires would be white, and it'd show flashbacks of him being bullied for being black. Totally ignoring the war on humanity from Vampires. I'd be fine with Aloy being gay, but I'm scared they would take her amazing story of the end of the beginning, the machines, the tribes... and turn it into some political saga focusing on her sexual preference and make her into a character that only means as much as who she sleeps with. Fxck the machines, fxck the war of the tribes, to hell with her fending off the threat of technology wielding zealots. We'd just get to save her female non binary lover from hulking white tribesmen that want to feed her to a scrapper. This is what is so hard about getting this across. Because when gamers go into uproar about these "equality" agendas, it makes us sound like we are against Gay, or Female, or Black or whatever. We're not. We just don't want these stories sacrificed just to tell a story about some political injustce. We've been ahead of the curve long before Sarkisian and these other fxcks came along. We've been kicking ass with Bayonetta and popping caps with C.J. in a gang war in GTA. We've been rocking Dark Elf mages that were female, and posting fan art of Sarah Kerrigan as the Brood Queen. Ana Bray [i]could have been that[/i]. And she could have done it and been as gay as she liked. If the focus of her story was her exploits as a gunslinger, or how she turned the tide at Twilight. Or if the [i]Campaign itself[/i] would have shown her in action, if that story had been developed into something like Aloy's or Princess Leia's... we'd have tossed her 46 rainbow colored engrams. Instead, we get no insight on her character other than she has a girlfriend who helped her do some tech stuff to unlock some files about some Bray something and Warmind something. And they kiss. And she feels sad now that her girly died. Instead of using the comic (or better, the story IN THE GAME) to better develope the over arching story of Destiny? We get a bland romance just for the sake of saying gay is okay. But when gamers protest shitty stories told on behalf of political reasons, [i]we[/i] get pointed to as bigots. Carry on. From now on, instead of building compelling stories around the battle of Dark and Light, the Iron Lords, The Vex, the Warmind, and legends we've only read about, let's just focus on how gay or black or non binary someone is, or how Efrideet gets paid less than Saladin for running Iron Banner.

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  • The OP needs to add this response to his opening post. It's the best I've read in a long time.

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